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Test Pet

Discussion in 'UO Tamer' started by Pawain, Mar 9, 2019.

  1. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    This pet does not exist in UO!

    If you reply to this thread do not use the name of the pet type please. Since this is a pet that will not exist in the game as it is, I do not want to confuse someone 6 months from now if they search the name.

    I am putting this here because I can place pictures on Stratics easier than I can UO forums.

    Here are the stats of the pet. It was a random one I chose.

    upload_2019-3-11_21-39-25.png
     
    #1 Pawain, Mar 9, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
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  2. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    I spent the day skilling it on TC. I hate skilling.

    I took it to the slugs to test the FWW and Chiv combo on the slugs. It looked very impressive.

    NOTE: SLUGS HAVE 15 RESIST!

    The FWW and Holy Light sometimes combine and toss up a lot of numbers.
    upload_2019-3-9_22-58-57.png


    The FWW as an area damage does kill the slugs very well. It would not be a place where two pets can hang out. But it never killed them all and walked up to me.
    upload_2019-3-9_22-58-39.png

    After MANY boring hours with the slugs and some random things I went to got the wresting to 100 and Parry to >100. I killed some stuff in the underworld to move on.
     
    #2 Pawain, Mar 9, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019
  3. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    Now Moving on to Navrey.

    You have to go thru a gauntlet of Goblins and stuff to get there. Also should set up your macros before you attempt this. The pet got hung twice even tho the dex is over 160 and me spamming all follow. The second time I could not retrieve it so I had to log on and off and on to get it back. Pets get hung around corners in dungeons when your player is running and sometimes just walking.

    Made it to Navrey.
    This damage was a little over the average for the high hits once in a while. I saw 3 in the 190 area, many in the 120s. I assume this is low because the Chiv is not skilled High.
    upload_2019-3-9_23-8-18.png

    I ran consume the whole time unless webbed away.
    Pet kept at 80% HP or more the whole time, just as any other pet type would.

    FWW does some multi damages so IMO it is worth the 30 Mana for each use. It does 6 -8 of the small damages. so more will appear after the pic.
    upload_2019-3-9_23-15-21.png


    Pet health was great (consume constant). I did not use any spells or drop any rocks.

    The time was 45 minutes to kill Navrey. The average for a GD from the old days is 40min.
    We had a poster that took fresh pets of different types and timed them on Navrey those averaged around 40 min.
    I feel this pet would get to 40 minutes when the Chiv and Ninja are at 120.
     
    #3 Pawain, Mar 9, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019
  4. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    Now side by side test against an allosaurus.

    This was very difficult for me to set up because my macros were not all made and you can't mount the test pet to lose aggro. The Hiryu died twice trying to get it set up. I'm bad at running 2 accounts.

    I found an AI/Chiv pet with low Chivalry in my stable. It has 92 Chiv. Unfortunately it was not built by me so its Poison resist is only 45.

    I found two allosaurus with resists that were close to the same. The one the Hiryu is fighting had 72 Physical resist. The one the test pet is fighting had an average of 70% between Phy and Energy.

    Both pets had to run consume of course. Hiryu has 115 Skills. Test pet posted above. The Hiryu needed heals sometimes and GoR because of the low Poison resist. The Hiryu also has no Stam regen so its Stamina was not 150 very often.

    Here is the point where I got it settled down enough to get pics.
    upload_2019-3-9_23-31-29.png

    upload_2019-3-9_23-32-1.png

    upload_2019-3-9_23-32-37.png

    upload_2019-3-9_23-33-11.png

    At this point both Allosaurus decided to walk around.
    upload_2019-3-9_23-34-8.png

    At the end of the fight the Hiryu needed heals the Allo was not going down easy.
    upload_2019-3-9_23-35-29.png

    Hiryu killed his target faster The test pet took another 3 min 25 seconds to kill his.
     
    #4 Pawain, Mar 9, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019
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  5. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    Got the Tactics to 120 so I edited the first post.

    Took it to kill a Dread Pirate sine it is going to be from that.

    Chiv above 100 now.

    Took 7 min 30 seconds have pics at 2 min intervals and then the death blow.

    upload_2019-3-11_21-34-45.png

    upload_2019-3-11_21-36-31.png

    upload_2019-3-11_21-36-57.png

    upload_2019-3-11_21-37-37.png

    Only saw small damages but it killed it.
     
    #5 Pawain, Mar 10, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019
  6. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    Reserved
     
  7. Khyro

    Khyro Sage
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    For anyone confused about the purpose of this post, since I know a lot of you choose not to use the official UO Forums: Look Here


    And my response:
    I really do try to avoid needless drama as it serves no purpose, but the snotty attitudes, condescension, personal attacks, and overall rude behavior is getting old.
     
    #7 Khyro, Mar 10, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019
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  8. Lord GOD(GOD)

    Lord GOD(GOD) Slightly Crazed

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    I'm a bit late to the discussion on these.

    The main thing I haven't seen asked that I'm wondering is does the 190 Dex substantially increase bandage speed? Bandages normally work in 20 Dex intervals capping at 140, so these could benefit from 180 Dex... is it speeding up that innate healing?
     
  9. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    Well so far no one has shown that the old version is overpowered.

    I have not seen anyone else show that they trained one and did actual testing before they said the pet was too much for us to handle. @Khyro So Violet was not speechless because of the intensity? That was my observation, if I am wrong I will post an apology there as long as I know what made the poster speechless. The things involved in intensity do not always make a good pet. There are many pets with lower intensities that can be built better than the ones starting high. Pets with the ability to gain Necro and magery have very high intensity and make very lousy pets.

    You say pets work off intensity. I say pets work off of the build they can get after training. The less wasted intensity points the better the build.

    Since all the replies so far have nothing to do with the pet being OP. I guess I can move on. I was going to take it to the mines today and get the tactics to 120 and kill some more stuff.

    Hopefully it got the point across to Kyronix. Maybe our next new pet will start like the test pet did originally and have a bonus. That is my goal. I do not care if some feel testing an item in a game and disproving others theories makes them not talk to me. Who are the grownups. I am very direct and to the point I do not throw in flowery articulations. I do not have Dons pleasantness.
     
    #9 Pawain, Mar 10, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019
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  10. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    I haven't seen anything where it was OP.... and I agree it's been neutered like everything to not really help the tamer much at all.. since 95% of any other player build would have had that allosaurus dead in 1/4 the time... Any dexer build, any mage build... and certainly a sampire would have cut through most that stuff in no time.....

    This is what I've been complaining about all along... the Tamer is still 90% obsolete... it serves as only 1 purpose... a tank to allow everyone else to outdamage you ..... outperform you and get all the drops and goods while you keep their back and get ZIP.

    This is the case everywhere... The tamer is just for show and a meat shield... Nothing has helped the tamer actually improve to be on par with any other build. It's been kept at the bottom of the heap. That's my opinion you can argue all you like but skill per skill against most any other build the tamer will take the longest to do just about everything.
     
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  11. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

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    Just one measly question..
    Why the "mud-puppy" skin form? And green? Or is it bue green?
    They could have chosen another graphic. Like a small Corgul, part human part fish or another graphic. This one is like a cross between a fish and salamander.
    The original name for this pet comes from the son of the Poseidon and one of Nereides. Both these are part human forms. Make the poor sob a Merman instead of a slug-looking blob, that turns its ugly flat-like face around and looks at its new world and wonders.
    "Who am I", "What am I", "Why did the UO gods made me this way", "And wtf..Why they made me green", "Am I supposed to be photosynthesizing?" etc etc. Case in point look at the superb graphics in the Frost Beetle, Osein Ram. This lill guy will be very jealous of these graphics, and he will develop an inferiority complex.:sad2:
     
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  12. Khyro

    Khyro Sage
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    The fact that you still think only the damage output of a pet is what determines whether a pet is overpowered or not is worrisome.

    Here's a quick multiple choice question for you:

    Q: Assuming 700 Str, Max Base Damage, 120 Scrolls, which of these pets is more powerful?
    A) 400 HP, Chivalry, Armor Ignore, 300 Mana, 20/5/30 Regens
    B) 600 HP, Chivalry, Armor Ignore, Healing, 400 Mana, 20/10/30 Regens
    C) 825 HP, Chivalry, Armor Ignore, Healing, 1500 Mana, 20/30/30 Regens
    D) 425 HP, Chivalry, Frenzied Whirlwind, 350 Mana, 20/5/30 Regens
    E) 800 HP, Chivalry, Armor Ignore, Frenzied Whirlwind, Healing, 400 Mana, 20/20/30 Regens
    F) They are all the same

    Your argument is "F) They are all the same", because as you have stated many times prior "they do no more damage than current pets". You have to look at more than a pets damage output to make a judgement on whether you feel it is overpowered or not.

    That's like saying you would be fine if they introduced a weapon to the reward system that was:
    - 15-17 Base Damage at 3.25 Swing Speed (The same damage as a Double-Axe)
    - 100% HML
    - 100% HSL
    - 100% HLL
    - 100% Hit Spell
    - 100% Hit Fatigue
    - 100% Hit Mana Drain
    - 100% HLD
    - 100% HLA
    - 9 Mana Regen
    - 9 Hit Regen
    - 9 Stamina Regen
    - 100% Damage Increase
    - 40% Swing Speed Increase

    I mean, its base damage and swing speed are the same as what we have already, so really that weapon is no more powerful right? I take it out into the field and by Double-Strikes are doing the same damage as my imbued weapon, so it is no more powerful. This is essentially the argument you are making for v1.

    Why not ask for a pet with 3000 Health/Mana that can get full Scrolls, Regens, Healing, and any spec it wants? Clearly it is the same as any other pet as it cannot do more damage right? Why stop there, I want a 10000 HP/Mana pet now since they are all the same.

    People don't answer to you Pawain, as much as that may hurt your ego. Just because you haven't seen the testing done, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. No one ever said "the pet is too much for you to handle", other than you when making snide comments.

    We tested many versions of the T on Test Center. We popped over 100 Statuettes to get the spawn range and trained many versions of it, including both high intensity ones (80%+), and low intensity ones (21%). v1 of the T was stupidly powerful in both intensity ranges. Again remember, power refers to more than just damage output.

    For some reason you think all we do is look at pets on a spreadsheet and never actually do anything with them. We do an incredible amount of testing before we comment on things or write articles. We didn't even provide feedback to Kyronix on the state of the T until several days later, after a lot of testing. We were also waiting to possibly see how these statuettes were going to be acquired as that is definitely something to consider, but the difficulty of acquisition was never revealed so you can't take that into account.

    No, Broadsword says pets work off of intensity. Again, Intensity is not a system we pulled out of our asses, it is how pets are created and balanced. If you want to change a pet, you need to look at the intensity of it and how it fits in with other pets around it. The intensity system is not without its flaws, such as the high cost of Magery/Eval and Necro/SS. But you can't simply just ignore it because you feel like it or don't like it.

    Broadsword has set a precedent on what they believe is too much intensity on a pet. This precedent is not only the revert code they put into the game to target ridiculously high intensity pets, but also them manually reverting the exploited Cu that Mith was bragging about on Stratics, and then parading around in Atl Luna. That was manually reverted by a Dev. Guess what? That pet had 150 less intensity than the v1 T was capable of. That's how powerful the v1 was.

    Actually all the replies showed this, you are just either incapable of seeing it, or choosing to ignore it. Again, there is more that contributes to a pet being OP than its damage output.

    Your goal is to have a grossly over intensity pet because you want an extremely costly (in points) build on it. You keep claiming the v1 T was great for beginners or newbies as they can't mess up the pet, but the v2 pet is even better for them because of the Wrestling. The pet still ends up with 500+ leftover points with a full 120 Chiv/AI build in its current state. I would say that is extremely player friendly and forgiving.

    We don't care whether you test the pet or not, we wish more people would actually go out and test things. Your tests are flawed for many reasons, including the fact that your test pets aren't even equal in stats, skills, or resists. You are trying to prove that they do the same damage as an existing pet, therefore aren't overpowered. You try to make this argument by showing that a Hiryu killed an Allosaurus faster than a T. Yea, well, that's what happens when the pet has the ability to debuff its primary damage type.

    Want to do accurate testing? Take your v1 T and then spec out a v2 T as close as possible. Make the sacrifices where you need to, such as Stamina Regen or Mana. Then level v1 and v2 up so they are equal in skill. Now repeat your test to see how they perform. I'm sure you will find the v2 T is more than capable still and not worthless like you believe.

    You constantly make snide, rude, and insulting comments in your posts along with personal attacks directed at people who do not share your opinion. So yea, I think that answers you own question.

    If you leave that crap at the door before you provide feedback, you will find you most likely will not get a counterpoint argument from us and your feedback may go a lot farther with the Devs. When you feel the need to make snide comments and attacks towards us in your feedback, we will defend ourselves and our position, and all it does is make you look childish and petty.
     
    #12 Khyro, Mar 10, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019
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  13. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    You will not change my opinion that the caps have worked on pets.

    I do feel that all pets should be able to reach caps in each section. We can decide if we want 820 HP and 1500 mana or more HP and less mana.

    Some sections we already put at caps and coincidently those are the dps section and resists.

    I prefer choice C above. I did not come up with the 825 HP. I prefer 850 and less mana.

    I agree that my posting style does not go well with the devs but that's how I express my opinions.
     
  14. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    I also am very happy with the T v2.

    Thanks for planting the seed for an added bonus.

    We can get all the bells and whistles with AI/chiv. I would like to advance pet building and would like the next pet to have enough training points to get more things in the build other than the basics. AI/chiv.

    Maybe we will get a necro pet that can be built a lot better than what we have now.
     
  15. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    I call it a Garden Slug. After being with it for hours I grew to like it. It needs some teeth tho. Like catfish "teeth".

    I do not know what graphic I would have chosen. But a small scalis would work.
     
  16. Meat Elemental

    Meat Elemental Seasoned Veteran
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    Not looking forward to the long grind that is probably required to get it... Wish it would just spawn like every thing else...

    Sent from my SM-N950W using Tapatalk
     
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  17. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    I can only use what the game gives us. Do you have a better example? I think showing in UO that other pets are the same or equal is proof that the test pet is not overpowered. I also offered to test the pet on other mobs but nobody offered a suggestion. Like i said I was ready to skill it up some more and kill whatever I could.

    Please advise me what pet type you would have chosen. I can only go with what I have in my stable.

    And lets see a pic of one that you said you built and tested. IMO I did not need to skill up one and test it but according to you, my info is flawed and all pets are not the same. So if that's the case where are your Guilds tests on an actual pet since you can not judge from just the stats. I can judge a pets damage abilities from stats but I also choose to do actual in game tests.

    You forgot to mention how the Hiryu, first is a Hiryu and not a lesser. Which means it does not have as good of a build as the test pet. I also mentioned it had only 45 poison resist and it had 0 Stam regen. Also it had just died twice so its stam and mana started lower than the test pets.

    IMO The Hiryu was at an unfair disadvantage.

    As for testing the two side by side, I pulled a few new ones, the best wrestling I got was 115 and none had over 60% intensity. So I would have had to scroll it up and built it without the FWW and then skill it.
    The only thing I could prove from that would be whether AI/Chiv is more damaging than AI/Chiv/FWW.
    I have a feeling that the AI/Chiv would be better on a single target.

    I would love to conduct that test when the publish goes live. If I can get two with 77% intensity and with 130 Wrestling.
     
    #17 Pawain, Mar 10, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019
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  18. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

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    Hmm.. graphics choices.. Umm..Amphibians or early amphibians.. Some cool images likely construed from fossil remains. These look a very tiny bit like our new pet.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    upload_2019-3-10_20-18-0.jpeg

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  19. Laura_Gold

    Laura_Gold Lore Keeper
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    So what does the adult form of a larva elemental look like?
    Ha ha ha ha

    Okay.
    The big question is: Is the final pet going to be as good as or better than a cu skidee?
    If it's not as good as a cu skidee, then everyone's still bringing cu skidees or greater dragons.
     
  20. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

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    They are still "balancing it", already got one nerf. Frankly, everyone suspects that the more we talk about it here, the more chances it will get more severe nerfs..
    Also the look of it or form, does not look too hot. Looks like a piece of BM if you've eaten lots of vegies..with some kind of face and no teeth..:devil:
     
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  21. Laura_Gold

    Laura_Gold Lore Keeper
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    It looks like a re-colored lava elemental.

    This is in keeping with the tradition of the Eodon "dinosaurs" most of which look like slightly magnified Ter Mur critters. Good job on the Triceratops though, which looks a lot like a boura with a new head. Kind of makes you wonder why they didn't cut the head off the riding boura and make a riding triceratops out of it.
     
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  22. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    It will higher hit points than a cu sidhe and can get the same magic.
    If the rng gives you a 77% or higher you can also add other things.

    Also has minimum of 110 starting wrestling.

    But you can not mount it. That could be a reason you wouldn't want it.

    So generally it does different damage and it is not a mount. But can be built like a cu.
     
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  23. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
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    Took to a Dread pirate. Posted above.
     
  24. Laura_Gold

    Laura_Gold Lore Keeper
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    So where/how do I find these test pets?
     
  25. SouthPaw

    SouthPaw Lore Keeper

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    They're only on test shard at Brit Commons.
     
  26. celticus

    celticus Babbling Loonie

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    Cool pic. Looks like Sylvester Stallone in "Bad Blood"..:)
     
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  27. popps

    popps Always Present
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    @Khyro

    "No, Broadsword says pets work off of intensity. Again, Intensity is not a system we pulled out of our asses, it is how pets are created and balanced."

    There is something I do not understand about this intensity thing....

    According to Pet Intensity Comparison | uo-cah.com a Shadow Wyrm (5 slots) can go from a Min Spawn Intensity of 8806 to a Max Spawn Intensity of 9652 and this allowed them to "train up" to a Min Trained Intensity of 8806 and Max Trained Intensity of 9652.

    Basically, NO CHANGE in their intensity through training...

    Yet, if I then look at the Dragon (Legacy) a 3 slots, which, as we know, no longer spawns, it used to go from a Min Spawn Intensity of 6599 to a Max Spawn Intensity of 6936 and this allowed them to "train up" to a Min Trained Intensity of 9601 and Max Trained Intensity of 9938.

    Not too much more then the Shadow Wyrm in regards to "trained" Intensity BUT, as a 3 slot versus the 5 of the Shadow Wyrm...

    Now, I do not understand "why" the Legacy Dragon would "gain" Intensity when trained while the Shadow Wyrm not.

    I do not think that this ("gaining" Intensity through training) is a peculiarity of Legacy pets because, if I look at the Dragon non-Legacy, a 4 slots pets, it "starts" with a Min Spawn Intensity of 6599 to a Max Spawn Intensity of 6936 but, through training still is able to "train up" to a Min Trained Intensity of 8100 and Max Trained Intensity of 8437.

    So, "why" is that that through the process of training some pets "gain" Intensity but others don't ?

    And "which" intensity is the important one to be looked at ? The one that the pet spawns with OR the one that the pet can be trained up to in order to then determine which pet is better then another (i.e. higher intensity....) ?

    Thanks
     
    #27 popps, Apr 9, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2019
  28. SouthPaw

    SouthPaw Lore Keeper

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    All Shadow Wyrms start at 5 slots, so they cannot be trained up. You're stuck with whatever they spawn as. Same for any other animal that spawns at 5 slots.

    Any pet that spawns at 1-4 slots gains intensity as we level them up and increase their stats and abilities. Legacy Dragons start at 3 slot, but once you select to train them they slot jump to 4 slot, so you only get 1 training level on them. Pets that can be trained are typically better than ones that spawn at 5 slots because we can add HP and Mana regen, increase their damage resistances, set Stamina to 150 so they hit faster, add Chivalry to increase damage, add abilities like Armor Ignore to increase damage, etc.

    It's important to check the animals spawn intensity because there is a range, sometimes pretty wide, so if you tame one with higher intensity the end result of the pet will be stronger. You want to focus primarily on STR/HP/Resists when looking for a good one to tame because those stats cost the most. Also some pets have over capped resists/skills, good to look for that as well.
     
    #28 SouthPaw, Apr 9, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2019
  29. Pawain

    Pawain I Hate Skilling
    Governor Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

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    Make an intensity thread to answer this please. @Khyro
     
  30. TimberWolf

    TimberWolf Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

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    Are you referring to how quickly you can bandage a pet, or how quickly a pet can bandage you, or how quick it bandages itself? It is my understanding that some years back the first two were locked and were not affected by dex. So at best bandage speed only affects self-applied bandages, and for pets I was under the assumption it was locked years ago as well ( shortly after the CU's arrived on the scene. But that information maybe wrong or out of date.
     
  31. Lord GOD(GOD)

    Lord GOD(GOD) Slightly Crazed

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    I wanted to know how fast they bandage themselves.
     
  32. Draza

    Draza Journeyman

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    Timberwolf is correct. Dex applies to walking speed, not healing speed.

    All pets that heal use a base time for it(6-8 seconds, if i remember correctly)